Straight Razor Place Forums - View Single Post - Norton 4000

Forzato · 01-31-2008, 07:44 PM

QUICK REVIEW:
The Norton 4000 - 8000 waterstone is considered by many to to be the waterstone to use for straight razor honing. When working correctly the Norton 4k/8k is indeed a superlative tool for honing to razor sharpness. However some users report difficulty with the Norton embedded grit problem which can be catastrophic and make the Norton 4k/8k stone completely unusable for honing. Because of this issue the Norton is unacceptable.

A MORE IN DEPTH REVIEW:
The stone needs a complete lapping before it's first use. Norton suggests the Norton lapping stone, but many users prefer a flat hard surface and various grits of wet sandpaper. When honing or lapping the Norton must be used wet with water. This review is based on honing with a 5/8 Dovo Blackstar carbon steel razor in conjunction with one new Norton 4k/8k stone. The Norton stone is about $80 US.

As stated, the Norton stone works very good - when it's working (see below). The 4k side will provide a fresh, correct bevel (it will not however remove any chips of significance without extensive use). The 8k side leaves a mirror finish that is truly near perfect. Given a working Norton 4k/8k, a loupe/microscope, a good strop, and decent razor to begin with - nothing more is needed to get a great shaving razor. The problem with embedded grit (see below) in the Norton 4k/8k is still being researched.

At this time it seems that some purchasers of the Norton stone will get a working stone, and some will get a defective stone. The defective stones cause severe damage to the precision edge of a straight razor. Either lapping embeds grit into the stone, or the stone comes with embedded grit. Either way the symptom is obvious to the observant person honing a straight razor...despite the stone feeling quite smooth to the touch - when honing (or backhoning) is performed the sensation of hitting little pieces of grit can be felt through the razor. Upon microscopic examination evidence of extreme damage (chipping) will be visible on the edge. A properly working stone will neither provide this sensation, nor cause the chipping damage to the edge. Sometimes this grit can be removed from the stone, other times it cannot. At the time of this writing, Norton customer service is very helpful, and willing to exchange the stones. More information will be posted here as it develops. Please also see the following threads for further details on the Norton embedded grit problem...

"Norton roughness, chips, edge shredding, micro chipping" Norton roughness, chips, edge shredding, micro chipping

"Norton Roughness"
Norton Roughness

"Pitted Norton 4000 water stone"
Pitted Norton 4000 water stone

"Pockmarked Norton 4000"
Pockmarked Norton 4K

"'feel' of the Norton 8k"
'feel' of the norton 8K

"Norton's shredding my edge"
Norton's shredding my edge...

"My Norton saga continues"
My Norton saga continues...

"Norton 8000... has this happened to any of you guys?"
Norton 8000...has this happened to any of you guys?

An alternative to the Norton 4k/8k waterstone is to backhone on 1500+ grit wet sandpaper with a marble tile or other flat surface, then finish by honing with a 12k Kitayama or other polishing waterstone. Others might use another waterstone or diamond hone in lieu of the sandpaper technique described.

The reviewer welcomes any feedback.

01-31-2008, 07:44 PM	#1 (permalink)
Forzato Status: < Banned User > Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Imperial America Posts: 41 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Norton 4000 - 8000 waterstone QUICK REVIEW: The Norton 4000 - 8000 waterstone is considered by many to to be the waterstone to use for straight razor honing. When working correctly the Norton 4k/8k is indeed a superlative tool for honing to razor sharpness. However some users report difficulty with the Norton embedded grit problem which can be catastrophic and make the Norton 4k/8k stone completely unusable for honing. Because of this issue the Norton is unacceptable. A MORE IN DEPTH REVIEW: The stone needs a complete lapping before it's first use. Norton suggests the Norton lapping stone, but many users prefer a flat hard surface and various grits of wet sandpaper. When honing or lapping the Norton must be used wet with water. This review is based on honing with a 5/8 Dovo Blackstar carbon steel razor in conjunction with one new Norton 4k/8k stone. The Norton stone is about $80 US. As stated, the Norton stone works very good - when it's working (see below). The 4k side will provide a fresh, correct bevel (it will not however remove any chips of significance without extensive use). The 8k side leaves a mirror finish that is truly near perfect. Given a working Norton 4k/8k, a loupe/microscope, a good strop, and decent razor to begin with - nothing more is needed to get a great shaving razor. The problem with embedded grit (see below) in the Norton 4k/8k is still being researched. At this time it seems that some purchasers of the Norton stone will get a working stone, and some will get a defective stone. The defective stones cause severe damage to the precision edge of a straight razor. Either lapping embeds grit into the stone, or the stone comes with embedded grit. Either way the symptom is obvious to the observant person honing a straight razor...despite the stone feeling quite smooth to the touch - when honing (or backhoning) is performed the sensation of hitting little pieces of grit can be felt through the razor. Upon microscopic examination evidence of extreme damage (chipping) will be visible on the edge. A properly working stone will neither provide this sensation, nor cause the chipping damage to the edge. Sometimes this grit can be removed from the stone, other times it cannot. At the time of this writing, Norton customer service is very helpful, and willing to exchange the stones. More information will be posted here as it develops. Please also see the following threads for further details on the Norton embedded grit problem... "Norton roughness, chips, edge shredding, micro chipping" Norton roughness, chips, edge shredding, micro chipping "Norton Roughness" Norton Roughness "Pitted Norton 4000 water stone" Pitted Norton 4000 water stone "Pockmarked Norton 4000" Pockmarked Norton 4K "'feel' of the Norton 8k" 'feel' of the norton 8K "Norton's shredding my edge" Norton's shredding my edge... "My Norton saga continues" My Norton saga continues... "Norton 8000... has this happened to any of you guys?" Norton 8000...has this happened to any of you guys? An alternative to the Norton 4k/8k waterstone is to backhone on 1500+ grit wet sandpaper with a marble tile or other flat surface, then finish by honing with a 12k Kitayama or other polishing waterstone. Others might use another waterstone or diamond hone in lieu of the sandpaper technique described. The reviewer welcomes any feedback. Attached Images Last edited by Forzato; 02-01-2008 at 04:21 AM.