What would you do?

headdoc · 08-15-2008, 04:47 AM

A client gifted me this W&B Celebrated Fine India Steel Razor today. He said that it had just been laying around his house for years after he attempted and then decided not to St8 shave. He put it up years ago. The condition is NOS with serious pitting on one side and some spotting/minor pitting on the face side. There is also pitting on the top side of the spine.
I'd like to get some input about how to proceed with restore? - or- just stabilize, hone, and go on. The etched side looks great but the other is- you'll see. I've cleaned it up with MAAS and cleaned the scales with Harley Spray Cleaner and Polish (from Harley Davidson store).
I'd like to hear some good ideas. I am uncertain if sanding down one side will harm the geometry. The orange peel pitting seems fairly deep.
Thanks for the help.
Headdoc

Utopian · 08-15-2008, 05:51 AM

That is quite the Jekyll and Hyde blade! I felt your pain once I scrolled down and saw the back side. I have no idea to what extent the "geometry" of the blade would be affected, but I certainly would start out with some low grit sanding of the back side to see how it goes and to get a better sense of how bad it is. If you don't feel you're up to the task, contact some of the folks who spend a lot of time doing restoration work. It might be a great candidate for some time in the vibrating tumbler.

Personally, I wouldn't mess with the scales at all till I got the blade sorted out.

Good luck with it.

onimaru55 · 08-15-2008, 12:31 PM

So sad to see such neglect.
If keeping it original is important to you then I guess you should leave it alone but obviously that pitting bugs you.

I've got one of these which was pretty bad too and my choice was to do a full resto which meant losing the etch but I had it re- engraved later. Not quite the same... but for me customising was acceptable.

Grinding too deeply on side sounds a bad idea tho.
Maybe some more folks have other options for you.

Jimbo · 08-15-2008, 12:36 PM

What are the scales made of? I'm wondering why the bad pitting seems so localised.

James.

floppyshoes · 08-15-2008, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utopian

It might be a great candidate for some time in the vibrating tumbler.

Sadly, the tumbler would remove the frosting on the etch and do very little to help the backside.
The only way I see to "fix" the pitting it to remove it. Removing it requires removal of material and this must be done evenly and with extreme care. This kind of work will also be relatively costly.

My advice is to hone and use it as-is. It should still take a good edge, it's just ugly. If you want a nice looking razor, take the money you'd spend to restore this one and buy a new razor. Then, keep the new razor in an argon filled chamber and turn on the lights for 5 minutes a year to look at it. All things turn to dust eventually.

English · 08-15-2008, 01:39 PM

I agree with Dan.

You can hone the razor up and enjoy a great shave from that blade, but the ugly pitting can only be removed with days of slow patient sanding. Even then, the blade will remain scarred especially to your eyes.

Save your money and your time and buy another razor in good condition. It will be a cheaper way to go and more fulfilling.

I have a couple of razors that had similar problems to the one gifted to you. I have spent hours to make them presentable, but they are not something I would choose to use and so I don't feel inclined to sell them. I keep them to practice honing with.

Sorry to be negative.

headdoc · 08-15-2008, 06:24 PM

[quote=English;248569]I agree with Dan.

You can hone the razor up and enjoy a great shave from that blade, but the ugly pitting can only be removed with days of slow patient sanding. Even then, the blade will remain scarred especially to your eyes.

I'v had a case of RAD since I started using Str8's in December and have accumulated @ 50 razors- new, old, NOS, japanese (both) and therefore have plenty to use. The scales are celluloid and feel smooth and cleaned up and polished very hell. However, they are warped. It seems that this has been exposed to being placed in the coffin and placed where it was hot and humid.

I sure would like to save the reversed etching and could leave that side alone with it's few spots. I am contemplating sanding down and polishing the pitted side but the blade would have had a lot of steel removed from that side. It might look a bit lopsided. I would not remove anything from the spine so that it shoule hone well althoug there would be some pits on the spine.

This razor looks like it had been honed only @ 1-2 times before being stored. There is a lot of metal on it.

albertpotash · 08-19-2008, 07:20 PM

I would work on the back realizing it won't be close to smooth and will have pitting. However, when it is shined it will have characteras long as you go for a satin not a chrome finish.
Al

thebigspendur · 08-20-2008, 12:34 AM

What you have to ask yourself is how much time do I want to spend on this project? That will dictate your course of action.

jwoods · 08-20-2008, 09:37 PM

thank god the rust is on the opposite side and not the side with the engraving, wow what a mess i thought when i scralled down, felt a little sick when i saw that i am sure you could sand it up it will take a while and you wont get it all out, but i should make a fine shaver nonetheless i have a couple of celebrated w&b that needed some tlc and they are the sharpest razors i have

fpessanha · 08-20-2008, 09:50 PM

I never did any restoration work, myself but, if I were in your shoes this what I'd do: I'd seriously consider restoring it. It would take time, of course, but I'd go for it. It was a gift and Wade and Butchers are considered to be very good blades. I'd buy another razor, though, to shave with. A restoration of this razor seems to be a project for many many days (if not months...) but it would, I suspect, pay off... The scaring would seem ugly but that would have been something you had done yourself and, in the end, it'll shave like a dream...

I say think about it... Keep us posted on this one, please.

nun2sharp · 08-20-2008, 10:07 PM

Too bad you couldnt fill the holes.

thebigspendur · 08-21-2008, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nun2sharp

Too bad you couldnt fill the holes.

Hmm, now you got me thinking. What could we use to fill the holes. maybe some bondo, or acid core solder? Maybe we're all thinking about razor restoration the wrong way. Maybe we should think like an autobody guy eh?

nun2sharp · 08-21-2008, 03:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Hmm, now you got me thinking. What could we use to fill the holes. maybe some bondo, or acid core solder? Maybe we're all thinking about razor restoration the wrong way. Maybe we should think like an autobody guy eh?

Thats what Ive been thinking, but use what?

onimaru55 · 08-21-2008, 04:51 AM

Maybe thinking way out of the box here but ... Cover the whole side or a section with a thin layer of heat resistant clear resin or CA, then sprinkle powdered precious metal or gemstone of choice. Paua shell or M.O.P. maybe. Re coat and voila.
Spine and bevel would contrast nicely too.
The Japanese do scabbards like this with urushi laquer.. This one's black with Paua shell. maybe there's a medium that would look just right . I guess it would need to balance the opposite side

fpessanha · 08-21-2008, 05:17 AM

I know nothing about restoration, but reading all these posts I wonder if all this isn't overkill... I mean... sanding will, eventualy minimize the pitting and, despite the scaring, the blade can still be honed to shave worthyness, right? If so, and if none of you more experienced gentlemen don't mind me asking, why go through such trouble? It's a good blade, it can shave... Does it really have to be shiny and perfect?

thebigspendur · 08-22-2008, 12:59 AM

Of course it doesn't have to be perfect. Its just a matter of how anal you are about your razors and the condition you want them to be in. besides, handsanding something like the razor pictured in this thread can take a mighty long time. Coating it with something could take less time.

Maybe some gold or silver leaf in layers to build up the damaged section until its all even? Or maybe some copper pounded out and epoxied to the blade or soldered to the blade?

nun2sharp · 08-22-2008, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fpessanha

I know nothing about restoration, but reading all these posts I wonder if all this isn't overkill... I mean... sanding will, eventualy minimize the pitting and, despite the scaring, the blade can still be honed to shave worthyness, right? If so, and if none of you more experienced gentlemen don't mind me asking, why go through such trouble? It's a good blade, it can shave... Does it really have to be shiny and perfect?

With all of our speculation some individual is going to say something that sparks the imagination of another individual and hopefully all this brainstorming/farting will lead to a solution to this problem or another. This is a challenge that a lot of people(IMO) would like to see overcome, it would truly be a restoration rather than a cosmetic fix and hopefully a lot of fun! Please join in!
BTW the only solution I can think of is to fill the pitted area in with welding rod, but that would be very fine workmnship not counting the damage done by screwing with the temper or blowing bigger holes into it. I know its not much help but maybe somebody else can make a run with it. Would that solder idea hold or fall loose.

onimaru55 · 08-22-2008, 10:44 AM

A naked flame for soldering would be a recipe for disaster. Even electric soldering irons run at about 450 celcius but molten solder dropped in the pits would cool quickly. I wouldn't risk it on my razor tho.
Lightly peening a soft metal in would be safer but would it stay in the pits. Something electrically inert like gold layered in or filling the pits is a thought and could even look ok. A bit of bling never hurts. I think some kind of epoxy and/or gold is an option . Any dentists out there ?!